• Domain Change - We have moved to https://paste-and-cut.com as our new domain.

    If you are using shortcuts or bookmarks for the old paste-and-cut.com.au domain, you need to update these or they will cease working from the 25th January, 2025. Please check the notice post for more details on this change to the forum.

COFFEE

Good grief @eggbert - a veritable market garden you have growing there!

As for @Arnold J Rimmer roasting coffee to take on a trip - now THAT is dedication! I presume there unlike say the US where most coffee is horrible but you can find somewhere decent there are no options like that in China?
 
There are plenty of coffee houses, but it tastes like the stuff in the US (insert vomiting smiley here). The single worst I have had was in Ronald Reagan airport in DC. It was at least made up for, with some excellent Mexican food.

We have been going there for our work since 2008, and the coffee hasn't gotten any better in that time.
 
Last edited:
This trip is Guangzhou for the Canton Fair, then YiWu City in Zhejiang, then Hangzhou for sightseeing and possibly Beijing to meet up with a contact.

Google the Futian market in YiWu - presently it is a single building that is about 8km long, 4-500m wide and 5 storeys high. Last count there were about 80,000 stores there.

The Canton Fair is marginally smaller I think, but is only there for a few weeks of the year, where Futian is a year-round adventure.

Re: Hangzhou - a pro tip ... don't try to walk around the West Lake. It is too big.
Source: personal experience. We probably got about 15km around it, and had to get a bus for the last 10-15km.

So, good coffee is essential (there... keeping it on-topic).
 
We found decent coffee in Taiwan, but they seem to be going more for syphons, and pourovers than espresso. Haven't been out that way in China for ages.
 
eggbert said:
We found decent coffee in Taiwan, but they seem to be going more for syphons, and pourovers than espresso. Haven't been out that way in China for ages.
Click to expand...
You're a little off with geography... Taiwan is more to the East. [emoji13] I don't think he was leaving the Mainland anyway... [emoji6]

I know the coffee scene well in Taiwan. It's changed a lot over the years and (real) espresso is more easily found in the larger cities.
 
It's still part of China depending on who you believe! I knew I was a ways out, but wondered if China was also going down the lighter siphons / manual process route rather than the espresso way that most of the western world had gone.
I've only tried siphon a couple of times and pourover too, but haven't really enjoyed them. It may be the places i tried them weren't very good but I haven't gone hunting for more.
 
eggbert said:
It's still part of China depending on who you believe! I knew I was a ways out, but wondered if China was also going down the lighter siphons / manual process route rather than the espresso way that most of the western world had gone.
I've only tried siphon a couple of times and pourover too, but haven't really enjoyed them. It may be the places i tried them weren't very good but I haven't gone hunting for more.
Click to expand...
No. It is China. The government during the civil war relocated to Taiwan. They were recognised by the UN (they helped start it). But since then power and recognition has shifted across to the other party. So today it's in a never-never-land of who do you believe. So technically it's not part of China, and it is China, and it is declared a part of China.

Siphon or VacPot is terrific if it's done well. Clear with no sediment, and often very bright. It's like tea -but it's coffee. Like all filter coffee, you need the right beans (roasted and variety).

Now talking about coffee in China: it's believed to be the fastest growing market today. It has people worried as its demand will be so huge! There is good coffee but still hard to find. The American influence always brings with it the American coffee culture... Need I say more.
 
That's the whole reason I didn't like the siphon - it is coffee flavoured tea. I didn't want to say that in my previous post in case my previous experience was made incorrectly, but I think you have just confirmed my feelings.
 
Well, the boss is pretty happy that she brought her own coffee. After sampling the hotel's finest, then my fast roast, she is grateful for the fast roast!

...Adds points to the account for later squandering (oddly enough, while listening to Strange Brew, by Cream)...
 
Decided to get back on the horse that threw me off....

Several years ago I had a Rancilio SIlvia v2. Cut a long story short I went into using it half cocked and as a result never got the hang of using it effectively, hence when we moved away from the big smoke it was sold off at around what I paid for it.

I'd been hankering to give a proper espresso machine another crack and as luck would have it I spotted a very well cared for v3 for sale in Coffs Harbour, promptly snatching it up!

The seller was a barista who said he'd seldom used it as it reminded him of his job too much - he tossed in a few handy odds and ends, nothing spesh. It still need a bit of a clean up and I pulled a lot of it apart to apply some auto wax to the painted chassis, which is very prone to rusting. Came up looking brand new. Got it at a good price, figured I'd give it a month or so and if I hadn't had more luck that last time I'd flog it off for break even AGAIN!

Thankfully a few weeks ago I was lucky enough to make the acquaintance of @Michael Evic , who is an absolute master of all things coffee related (jaw dropping gear!). Anyway again luck smiled upon me as he was looking to sell off a few items and bought a Compak K3 Touch from him.

About the 3rd day into using the v3 and after a few duffer efforts have basically got the right workflow for us down (as the missus insists on soy milk in her bevies) and also atleast a decent beginning of technique in using the Silvia which is producing better drinks than I was in several months with the v2.
 
Nick the Knife said:
Decided to get back on the horse that threw me off....

Several years ago I had a Rancilio SIlvia v2. Cut a long story short I went into using it half cocked and as a result never got the hang of using it effectively, hence when we moved away from the big smoke it was sold off at around what I paid for it.

I'd been hankering to give a proper espresso machine another crack and as luck would have it I spotted a very well cared for v3 for sale in Coffs Harbour, promptly snatching it up!

The seller was a barista who said he'd seldom used it as it reminded him of his job too much - he tossed in a few handy odds and ends, nothing spesh. It still need a bit of a clean up and I pulled a lot of it apart to apply some auto wax to the painted chassis, which is very prone to rusting. Came up looking brand new. Got it at a good price, figured I'd give it a month or so and if I hadn't had more luck that last time I'd flog it off for break even AGAIN!

Thankfully a few weeks ago I was lucky enough to make the acquaintance of @Michael Evic , who is an absolute master of all things coffee related (jaw dropping gear!). Anyway again luck smiled upon me as he was looking to sell off a few items and bought a Compak K3 Touch from him.

About the 3rd day into using the v3 and after a few duffer efforts have basically got the right workflow for us down (as the missus insists on soy milk in her bevies) and also atleast a decent beginning of technique in using the Silvia which is producing better drinks than I was in several months with the v2.
Click to expand...

I own the V2 and it makes excellent brews. I had 1 x 3 group & 2 x 2 group machines in my vans till I sold them off and though the Rancillio lacks the "oomp" of the 15 & 20 Amp machines, with a good roast and the grinder "wound-in" a great brew is assured. Like using a straight, if you are not taking care every shave/brew you are going to have poor results.

If you have the 4 M's is order you're there.

Miscela (Mixture/blend/roast.)

Macinacaffe (Milling/grind}

Macchina (Machine/extraction process)

Mano (Hand of the man/barista)
 
Dale.Whiley said:
If you have the 4 M's is order you're there.

Miscela (Mixture/blend/roast.)

Macinacaffe (Milling/grind}

Macchina (Machine/extraction process)

Mano (Hand of the man/barista)
Click to expand...
What about Mmmmm... Water?
 
Phew after a couple of so-so uses of the Silvia I decided to spend the last few hours refining the grind vs dose vs tamp interplay. Now I know there's still other variables (e.g beans, age of them, blah blah) but keeping it in the realm of core stuff I went through about a half dozen or so shots just using the standard improved Silvia 14g basket.

Choked it a few times and loads of gushers, stuck pucks, sloppy pucks, etc etc....however eventually got something that was pretty damn close to the 25ml in 20-30sec.

Anyway used the last double shot to make a nice flat white - which was thrown back far too easily and all the other shots were collected and will be used to make a Tiramisu later on - as much as they were a lil off colour I thought it a tad on the sinful side to toss down the drain. So hopefully I only have to apply very minor tweaks to the drind/dose settings from here.

I thought I'd found a cheap source for some 17g ridgeless baskets that claimed to be identical to the VST ones. However alas the vendor got mixed up and sent me ridged ones instead, as they'd sold all their ridgeless ones out. To their credit after I flagged with them that my main reason for wanting the ridgeless ones was to allow me to preload the baskets for back to back double shots they gave me a full refund and said they were happy for me to keep the baskets.

So FWIW I can highly recommend Cleanskin Coffee Co as they owned the mistake right from the get go and were without doubt one of the easiest vendors to deal with in any sphere I've ever had the pleasure to come across. They also sell very reasonably priced green beans. Lil mistakes happen but dealing with a vendor that resolves it amicably without having to be forced is an absolute godsend.

I'm assuming I can apply the same grind and just dosed up on the larger baskets but I guess we'll see. Still need to work on my tamping technique as I tend to end up skewing it a tad so that it's not flat but slightly tilted. So many variables but it does allow you to put in perspective how bad most of the cafe coffee's you pay for are as even my WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY off perfect ones are better than around 90% of the stuff I've bought and paid for in 'good' cafes.

That said I've gotten a massive amount of extra respect for the multi-tasking skill level that even average baristas possess....as whilst I can fine tune the dose distribution in the basket with a bamboo skewer for a few minutes they just have to crack on. So fair play to them.
 
How weird. All this new talk of coffee machines.

I went into Myer the other weekend and bought a Sunbeam Espresso Bar, and it came with a grinder in the box. I got it for $0.00, as I had enough Rewards points on the credit card.

I'm certain that it is nothing like a professional espresso machine, but I have only been to one place that makes better coffee around here (IMO). This thing only has the one group head, but why do I need more?

50 or so coffees in, I think I have my grind fineness worked out, and I feel like I have the right tamping pressure too. This machine has a pressure gauge on it, with a guide to a perfect (according to the gauge) pour. Recently I have been hitting the gauge almost dead centre of the preferred zone, and the coffee is coming out on the thin side of syrup, so I'm happy. I might add that I am getting really nice light brown crema as well, so that makes me happy (I have gone back to a darkish medium roast, from a full French roast).

And for me, it is heartening to get good results out of my beans.

I'm doing ristrettos and espressos, so syrupy is about right.
 
@Arnold J Rimmer , is good to hear that you're getting results that are meeting your approval - at the end of the day thats what its all about.

Sunbeam, Breville and a few others tend to use both pressurised baskets and tricks in the portafilter of their entry level machines to make them both more user friendly, tolerant of dose/tamp/grind issues and able to be used with supermarket coffee. The minor trade off is that you're not seeing actual crema but rather a fake/forced crema that looks like the real thing but simply isn't the same other than it looks similar. Thats why you'll hear of some folks going to lengths to source upressurised baskets to use in their machines etc BUT thats IMHO not worth the hassle as they're not designed to use them.

There's actually a lot of debate about even whether legit crema is a good or bad thing - just goes to show how open to perception coffee is.

Also IMHO Sunbeam are a tad misleading in their selling several devices as 'coffee grinders' despite the fact they do not grind the coffee but rather use a metal blade spun at high speed to chop/cut the coffee. It might sound pedantic but these are not grinders. The difference is that they tend to give a very large variation in the resulting particle size e.g very big bits and very small bits. Whereas with a grinder you can essentially select the size of the grind by altering how close the burrs will be to each other. These choppers can only be used for shorter or longer to TRY and alter the outcome.

I say all this owning one myself - again don't get me wrong the pressurised baskets in the Cafe Espresso II and similar machines are MADE to be tolerant of things like this - hence SB including it but their calling it a grinder just misleads folks.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top