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Modify/Upgrade a cheapie shaving soap...? Viable?

Nick the Knife

Nick the Knife

Krill Enabler
Grand Society
Folks,

There's been a bunch of chat about relatively cheap shaving soaps recently e.g Arko - and it got me thinking whether there'd be an easy way to modify/upgrade a relatively cheap and cheerful soap that performs very well....like an Arko.

The idea being that you'd start with a cheap product that was already a very good performer....Arko is a great example of this. Then you'd add a few things that would fill the new chinks in the armour that this product might have.....so with Arko some type of a superior scent would be an obvious choice (sandlewood? kaffir lime?).

Also from what I've read a betonite clay would be an excellent choice and enhance the smoothness of the shave but also the effects on ones skin.

Being a relatively soft product Arko is a great contender for this was I'd imagine it'd melt down relatively easily in the microwave or double boiler. I don't know if you'd add the essential oil/scent directly or if you'd need a carrier oil....the clay could be added directly I'd say.

Anyone have any thoughts on this type of a project? I can't imagine why it wouldn't work......that said I think the only danger might be that in melting the Arko/shaving soap you're not able to get it to reconstitute properly again....like essentially the materials in it split.

I also think if you get too 'out there' with materials you put in you could end up with it not blending again properly.

Any thoughts welcomed.

Cheers, Nick
 
Nick the Knife said:
Folks,

There's been a bunch of chat about relatively cheap shaving soaps recently e.g Arko - and it got me thinking whether there'd be an easy way to modify/upgrade a relatively cheap and cheerful soap that performs very well....like an Arko.

The idea being that you'd start with a cheap product that was already a very good performer....Arko is a great example of this. Then you'd add a few things that would fill the new chinks in the armour that this product might have.....so with Arko some type of a superior scent would be an obvious choice (sandlewood? kaffir lime?).

Also from what I've read a betonite clay would be an excellent choice and enhance the smoothness of the shave but also the effects on ones skin.

Being a relatively soft product Arko is a great contender for this was I'd imagine it'd melt down relatively easily in the microwave or double boiler. I don't know if you'd add the essential oil/scent directly or if you'd need a carrier oil....the clay could be added directly I'd say.

Anyone have any thoughts on this type of a project? I can't imagine why it wouldn't work......that said I think the only danger might be that in melting the Arko/shaving soap you're not able to get it to reconstitute properly again....like essentially the materials in it split.

I also think if you get too 'out there' with materials you put in you could end up with it not blending again properly.

Any thoughts welcomed.

Cheers, Nick
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I don't see why it wouldn't work. Would be simple to start out with something like Arko + some essentials oils (although why anyone would mess with the Arko scent is beyond my understanding :laugh:).
 
There are plenty of 'Melt & Pour' style glycerine-based soaps that are available. I know that some over YKW that like them and will add their own scents to them. Some even will add other soaps to the base too - I think Cade was a bit of a favourite at some point. You could could certainly use something like Col. Conk soaps in this way.

From my own perspective, something like Arko would be much nicer if there was some other citrus involved. Grapefruit and Lime/Mandarin would certainly smooth out the sharp 'industrial' lemon nose. You could also add some herbal scent - clary sage?

Bentonite clay would only be useful to add if the soaps did not lather slickly. I would think that anything more than 33% arko would never have that issue.

Someone give me a recipe to try with some MWF lol
 
Razormonsta said:
There are plenty of 'Melt & Pour' style glycerine-based soaps that are available. I know that some over YKW that like them and will add their own scents to them. Some even will add other soaps to the base too - I think Cade was a bit of a favourite at some point. You could could certainly use something like Col. Conk soaps in this way.

From my own perspective, something like Arko would be much nicer if there was some other citrus involved. Grapefruit and Lime/Mandarin would certainly smooth out the sharp 'industrial' lemon nose. You could also add some herbal scent - clary sage?

Bentonite clay would only be useful to add if the soaps did not lather slickly. I would think that anything more than 33% arko would never have that issue.

Someone give me a recipe to try with some MWF lol
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Yes, I saw a few of those kits......dunno how they'd go. I like the idea of the Arko or similar as its proven to be a winner. So not trying to reinvent the wheel but just improve it a tiny bit.

AGree with another more tasty citrus scent......sage or something a bit herby is a good idea as well.

You may well be right with regards the Bentonite, the clay may also have some benefits for the skin after shaving - some pricier end soaps like to try and claim this. Might be something to try out anyway as I need to order some more essential oils to burn around the house.

Dunno if MWF would go well if you melted it though - I remember hearing that someone who melted it down found that all the lanoline would not reintegrate back into the soap when it cooled so it was kinda horrible.
 
This sounds good.

I do love the Arko scent though lol...

If it went well you could do a big batch of the mix you liked pour into a mold.

Will be interested to see how it goes.
 
Lynchy said:
If it went well you could do a big batch of the mix you liked pour into a mold.
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Or a wooden bowl that you have already used up the soap from, you could just dump it in there.

There's also those wooden bowls from Bestshave. No lids though.
 
Razormonsta said:
Or a wooden bowl that you have already used up the soap from, you could just dump it in there.

There's also those wooden bowls from Bestshave. No lids though.
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That's kinda what I was thinking.

Also I really like the look of Mikes Natural soaps, although I've never used them they just look boutiquey and cool.

If it melts well, and re melts well, you could pour into a rectangle mould and then cookie cut out disks? Re melt and scraps and repeat!

Also the aluminium tins from here look cool, Shaving Bowls and Mugs | West Coast Shaving
Or the others if you wanted to get really expensive!
 
I've had some success in upgrading soaps by adding liquid Glycerine( bought at the Food Store or Pharmacy) to the bowl of lather. Added 6-8 drops and it makes a smother latter.
The other things that I've done is added liquid Menthol to the mix for a little more zing to the soap. Again 5-6 drops
For Straight Razor shavers . Adding a little MWF to the mix helps a weaker soap but harder to do. I use a Surabachi So I can do half the bowl in one soap and half in another without too much problem. This also helps the MWF by adding the fragrance of another soap.
 
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Nick the Knife said:
Dunno if MWF would go well if you melted it though - I remember hearing that someone who melted it down found that all the lanoline would not reintegrate back into the soap when it cooled so it was kinda horrible.
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Don't think you can melt a tallow based soap like MWF or ARKO. Never tried it myself but have always read that only vegetable based soaps are melt and pour. Nothing wrong with grating and mixing in whatever you want to mix in and then pressing it in to a bowl or a stick mold.
 
Pjotr said:
Don't think you can melt a tallow based soap like MWF or ARKO. Never tried it myself but have always read that only vegetable based soaps are melt and pour. Nothing wrong with grating and mixing in whatever you want to mix in and then pressing it in to a bowl or a stick mold.
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That's glycerine soaps that melt and pour. Everything else will burn. There is a gentle double boil method for others, but it sound like more hassle than its worth. The sort of thing people who hang out on shaving forums might do...

Welcome back btw. Nice to hear you're not dead.
 
Ah cool, thanks guys.....some good info there. I might try melting 1/3 or so of a stick of Arko just to see how it solidifies again and then assess feasibility from there.
 
I have a pot of bentonite on my desk at work, got it from the home brew shop for about $2.
 
Drubbing said:
...............Welcome back btw. Nice to hear you're not dead.
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Almost back. On the same parallel in Mauritius. Don't ask me why, 'cause it's a horrible place. Take your average Asian ghetto and plonk it in the middle of Queensland sugar cane fields and there you have Mauritius.
 
Pjotr said:
Almost back. On the same parallel in Mauritius. Don't ask me why, 'cause it's a horrible place. Take your average Asian ghetto and plonk it in the middle of Queensland sugar cane fields and there you have Mauritius.
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But those bunglaows built right over the ocean look so plush...
 
FWIW it isn't going to be feasible to 'melt' the Arko or anything tallow based. Have read multiple reports which say it does not work and you just end up with a mess and unusable soap.

I really don't know if 'squishing' an essential oil into several sticks of Arko which is in a container is really going to be feasible....I cannot imagine that it would combine well at all and think it'd just end up making a mess & leaving pockets of oil throughout the soap....so I'm hesitant to do this.

As has been mentioned earlier if you were using a glycerine based soap it'd be a lot easier as you could just add this to the melted soap mix. So the best option I'd imagine for tallow based soaps is to either:
  • combine them manually with another better scented tallow based soap
  • add a few drops of essential oil to your loaded brush when lathering
  • Try and manually combine with grated hard/triple milled soap
  • Add some scented shaving cream to your loaded shaving brush

Bummer....you'd have thought there was a way to add a decent scent but I don't think so. Thin I'll put this one in the 'Unsuccessful' basket. :-)
 
Nick the Knife said:
..........Bummer....you'd have thought there was a way to add a decent scent but I don't think so. Thin I'll put this one in the 'Unsuccessful' basket. :-)
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I'm no organic chemist or soap maker but logically, both mediums being oil/organic based, I would have thought that they'd mix very well and I don't think "pockets of oil" would be present in the final mixture. Soap is after all designed to adhere to oil and quite frankly I'd be surprised if it didn't work. Why not give it a try with a wee bit and try it out? Of course mixing it in a liquid form would be easier but on the other hand the higher temperature would also mean you're driving off the lighter, short chained smelly fraction. I wouldn't give up on the idea personally.
 
Pjotr, haha alright you talked me into it. I'm a sucker for logic based arguments and what you said there simply made sense. I'd say it'd take a fair bit of mixing as even though Arko is relatively soft it still is relatively firm at room temp.

Interestingly I received some of the Turkish shave sticks I ordered through a relative today, they're the very hard to get Camelot Classic Shave Sticks. Now these are actually a perfect candidate for this type of a process as they're apparently excellent.........have a very nondescript scent (I'd call it olde school soap scent, very bland) and are very soft (finger prints in the sides of them at room temp!)

Hmmm ok hunting some essential oils as we have nothing suitable around the house.....these guys look quite good value (WARNING - this seller is horrible!!!!! Avoid at all costs!!!).....think I'd go with the 30ml size (you can get down as low as 5ml up to 100ml). I know essential oils are always open to a bit of shady operating with them using crap materials etc but watchagunnado.

Just waiting for them to clarify if the buy 3 get 1 offer is ok if you just buy 3 x 1 of different oils.

Hmmmm is tricky as a lot of oils actually can irritate the skin.....after looking I'm leaning towards:
  • Clary sage - has loads of good stuff written about it and apparently does everything for you short of cooking you breakfast!
  • Bergamot - I know I like this one (think Earl Grey tea), apparently is great in skin applications. Citrus like so will blend well.
  • Lime - bit of a no brainer, seems to be in every 2nd shaving product and has great skin properties.
  • Grapefruit - gets great reviews but worried I've got too much citrus!
  • Cypress - reads very well and I think I'd have to bump one of the citrus ones for this!

Oh I also remembered we have some Lavender oil around the house, which blends well with citrus - so I might try that out later on the Arko I have in a tub. Again is meant to be good with skin applications.

Anyone else have any suggestions? Like I said you have to check up on them as a lot of things that smell nice also have issues causing skin irritations etc.
 
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I'm no organic chemist, but I am a chemist (the real type not a pill seller).

Saponification, soap making is pretty simple process. If I remeber correctly and I am not using a text or wikipedia, you take some triacyl glyceride lipids (fats/oils) and react them with hydroxide, this breaks the triacyl bonds to release the free fatty acids, this reacts to .... nah fuk it I can't remember.

The idea is one end of the molecule is like a oil, organic compund. the other end is charged and attracts other charged particles like dirt inorganic chemicals. This is how the actual soap works. you need a lather of bubbles to increase the surface area and allow encapsulation of the oil or dirt.

I've never thought about melting soap, I don't think it would work. It is a chemical process rather than a heating cooling process, much like when concrete dries, the water doesn't so much evaporate as react.
 
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